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Analytics · Method validation

Second pass at: LOD and LOQ: definitions people get wrong

SP
s.poulsenTL3Regular13 Aug 2025#1

Posting this under the heading it deserves: Second pass at: LOD and LOQ: definitions people get wrong Everything below is what sits behind that.

Working through the identity arithmetic and I would like it checked.

semaglutide has a monoisotopic mass close to 4113.6 Da. On an electrospray instrument I would expect to see the multiply charged series rather than the intact singly charged ion, so for the doubly charged species I calculate (4113.6 + 2 x 1.00728) / 2, and for the triply charged the analogous expression.

The observed values in the report sit within a few ppm of those. My question is what that actually establishes, because I have seen people treat a mass match as a purity result and I do not think it is one.

0 likes 11mo
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NLoughranTL3Regular15 Aug 2025#2

Worth separating two things that the opening post runs together.

Robustness: the method gives consistent results when minor parameters vary. Tested by deliberately varying pH, temperature, flow rate, and mobile phase composition within reasonable ranges and demonstrating that results stay within acceptance.

3 likes 11mo
IB
i.beaulieuTL2 Moderator16 Aug 2025#3
NLoughran, post #2: Worth separating two things that the opening post runs together. Robustness: the method gives consistent results when minor parameters vary. Tested by deliberately varying pH, temperature, flow rate, and mobile phase composition within reasonable ranges and demonstrating that results stay within acceptance. Go to post

This follows post #2 rather than contradicting it.

Linearity: the detector response is proportional to compound concentration across the working range. Demonstrated by running standards at multiple concentrations and showing R-squared values typically ≥0.99.

15 likes in reply to #2 11mo
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IMainwaringTL3Regular17 Aug 2025 · edited#4
s.poulsen, post #1: Posting this under the heading it deserves: Second pass at: LOD and LOQ: definitions people get wrong Everything below is what sits behind that. Working through the identity arithmetic and I would like it checked. semaglutide has a monoisotopic mass close to 4113.6 Da. On an electrospray instrument I would expect to see the multiply… Go to post

Precision and repeatability: within-run and between-run variability of the method. Acceptance criterion is typically a relative standard deviation of ≤2% for area measurements.

30 likes in reply to #1 11mo
MG
m.guerreroTL218 Aug 2025#5
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stopper_traceTL2Member19 Aug 2025#6

On post #2 — agreed on the reasoning, with one qualification.

Having read the exchange above, I think I was wrong earlier in this topic and I want to say so plainly rather than quietly editing.

The correction was fair and I had been repeating something I had not checked carefully enough.

6 likes 11mo
NH
n.hartmannTL2 Moderator20 Aug 2025#7

System suitability: injections run at the start of a batch to establish that the instrument and column are performing. Acceptance criteria typically include replicate precision (RSD ≤2%), peak tailing (0.8–1.5), theoretical plates (>2000), and resolution (>1.5).

21 likes 11mo
VS
vial_slopeTL3Regular20 Aug 2025#8
s.poulsen, post #1: Posting this under the heading it deserves: Second pass at: LOD and LOQ: definitions people get wrong Everything below is what sits behind that. Working through the identity arithmetic and I would like it checked. semaglutide has a monoisotopic mass close to 4113.6 Da. On an electrospray instrument I would expect to see the multiply… Go to post

Forced degradation studies: deliberately stress the material with acid, base, oxidant, heat, light to generate degradation products and demonstrate that the method can separate them from the parent peak. Acceptance is that the method is stability-indicating.

0 likes in reply to #1 11mo
JC
j.cabreraTL2 Moderator21 Aug 2025#9
IMainwaring, post #4: Precision and repeatability: within-run and between-run variability of the method. Acceptance criterion is typically a relative standard deviation of ≤2% for area measurements. Go to post

Why two laboratories may disagree: after validating the same method, they may still report different purity on the same sample due to integration differences, column age differences, subtle differences in mobile phase pH or temperature. This is normal and not a sign that one is wrong.

31 likes in reply to #4 11mo
TS
taper_shiftTL3Regular22 Aug 2025#10

Specificity: the method can distinguish the intended compound from related impurities and degradation products. Tested by comparing results on pure compounds, mixtures of compounds, and degraded samples.

0 likes 11mo
AE
a.eriksenTL2 Moderator23 Aug 2025 · edited#11
NLoughran, post #2: Worth separating two things that the opening post runs together. Robustness: the method gives consistent results when minor parameters vary. Tested by deliberately varying pH, temperature, flow rate, and mobile phase composition within reasonable ranges and demonstrating that results stay within acceptance. Go to post

Limits of detection and quantitation: LOD is the lowest concentration that produces a signal above background. LOQ is the lowest concentration at which the method meets precision and accuracy acceptance criteria. Both are determined empirically.

2 likes in reply to #2 11mo
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BBramleyTL3Regular23 Aug 2025#12

This follows post #9 rather than contradicting it.

I disagree with the reply above, and I think the disagreement is substantive rather than terminological.

The distinction being drawn does not survive when you look at the published data for this specific question. I would be glad to be shown wrong on this, because the version I am arguing against is more convenient.

0 likes 11mo
CS
c.serranoTL2 Moderator24 Aug 2025#13

Stability-indicating method: one that can separate a compound from its degradation products. Critical for assay methods that claim to measure actual degradation (as opposed to purity, which is orthogonal).

26 likes 11mo
TN
t.nardoneTL3Regular25 Aug 2025#14

Transfer between laboratories: a method can be transferred from one lab to another, but the receiving lab needs to demonstrate that they can achieve the same performance. This requires comparative testing and sometimes small method refinements.

12 likes 11mo
IA
i.amankwahTL2 Moderator25 Aug 2025#15
IMainwaring, post #4: Precision and repeatability: within-run and between-run variability of the method. Acceptance criterion is typically a relative standard deviation of ≤2% for area measurements. Go to post

Coming back to post #13, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer.

Accuracy: the method measures what you intend to measure. For purity methods, this is tested by spike-and-recover experiments: add a known amount of impurity to a sample and measure whether you recover the added amount.

4 likes in reply to #4 11mo
JV
j.vandermolenTL326 Aug 2025#16
BC
b.correiaTL2 Moderator27 Aug 2025#17

Transfer between laboratories: a method can be transferred from one lab to another, but the receiving lab needs to demonstrate that they can achieve the same performance. This requires comparative testing and sometimes small method refinements.

0 likes 11mo
GV
g.valckenaereTL3Regular27 Aug 2025#18
a.eriksen, post #11: Limits of detection and quantitation: LOD is the lowest concentration that produces a signal above background. LOQ is the lowest concentration at which the method meets precision and accuracy acceptance criteria. Both are determined empirically. Go to post

Stability-indicating method: one that can separate a compound from its degradation products. Critical for assay methods that claim to measure actual degradation (as opposed to purity, which is orthogonal).

18 likes in reply to #11 11mo
SD
st.dialloTL2 Moderator28 Aug 2025#19

I read post #17 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.

Specificity: the method can distinguish the intended compound from related impurities and degradation products. Tested by comparing results on pure compounds, mixtures of compounds, and degraded samples.

0 likes 11mo
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HHidalgoTL2Member29 Aug 2025#20
IMainwaring, post #4: Precision and repeatability: within-run and between-run variability of the method. Acceptance criterion is typically a relative standard deviation of ≤2% for area measurements. Go to post

Linearity: the detector response is proportional to compound concentration across the working range. Demonstrated by running standards at multiple concentrations and showing R-squared values typically ≥0.99.

27 likes in reply to #4 11mo
ER
eire_readerTL229 Aug 2025#21
ZS
z.szaboTL2 Moderator30 Aug 2025#22

Robustness: the method gives consistent results when minor parameters vary. Tested by deliberately varying pH, temperature, flow rate, and mobile phase composition within reasonable ranges and demonstrating that results stay within acceptance.

4 likes 11mo
PN
p.novotnyTL2Regular30 Aug 2025#23
g.valckenaere, post #18: Stability-indicating method: one that can separate a compound from its degradation products. Critical for assay methods that claim to measure actual degradation (as opposed to purity, which is orthogonal). Go to post

post #22 is right about the mechanism and I think understates the practical bit.

For anyone arriving from a search: the marked solution above is the direct answer, and the replies underneath it add the caveats that make it safe to use.

19 likes in reply to #18 11mo
FH
f.haddadTL2 Moderator31 Aug 2025#24
s.poulsen, post #1: Posting this under the heading it deserves: Second pass at: LOD and LOQ: definitions people get wrong Everything below is what sits behind that. Working through the identity arithmetic and I would like it checked. semaglutide has a monoisotopic mass close to 4113.6 Da. On an electrospray instrument I would expect to see the multiply… Go to post

Worth separating two things that post #20 runs together.

Precision and repeatability: within-run and between-run variability of the method. Acceptance criterion is typically a relative standard deviation of ≤2% for area measurements.

0 likes in reply to #1 11mo
CP
citation_peakTL3Regular1 Sep 2025#25

Range: the concentration range over which the method has been validated. Going outside the validated range is going outside the method's demonstrated performance.

2 likes 11mo
MN
ma.nascimentoTL2 Moderator1 Sep 2025 · edited#26

Coming back to post #24, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer.

Limits of detection and quantitation: LOD is the lowest concentration that produces a signal above background. LOQ is the lowest concentration at which the method meets precision and accuracy acceptance criteria. Both are determined empirically.

8 likes 11mo
KR
k.redgraveTL2Member2 Sep 2025#27

post #26 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

System suitability: injections run at the start of a batch to establish that the instrument and column are performing. Acceptance criteria typically include replicate precision (RSD ≤2%), peak tailing (0.8–1.5), theoretical plates (>2000), and resolution (>1.5).

26 likes 11mo
SI
s.ivaturiTL2 Moderator2 Sep 2025#28
IMainwaring, post #4: Precision and repeatability: within-run and between-run variability of the method. Acceptance criterion is typically a relative standard deviation of ≤2% for area measurements. Go to post

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

0 likes in reply to #4 11mo
OP
o.pasqualeTL1Member3 Sep 2025 · edited#29

This follows post #26 rather than contradicting it.

Forced degradation studies: deliberately stress the material with acid, base, oxidant, heat, light to generate degradation products and demonstrate that the method can separate them from the parent peak. Acceptance is that the method is stability-indicating.

4 likes 11mo
ID
i.dumitruTL2 Moderator4 Sep 2025#30

Specificity: the method can distinguish the intended compound from related impurities and degradation products. Tested by comparing results on pure compounds, mixtures of compounds, and degraded samples.

12 likes 11mo