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Outcomes · Body composition · continued

Circumference measurements as a poor man's composition estimate posts 91–113

This is a continuation of a long topic, addressed by post number rather than by page. Start at post 1 · go to the accepted answer.

CS
c.silvaTL2 Moderator23 Aug 2024#91
IHollingworth, post #20: Picking up post #17: that is the part I would want checked first. Lean mass loss during rapid weight reduction: depends on protein intake, resistance training volume, and total energy deficit. Adequate protein and maintaining training intensity both help preserve lean mass. Go to post

Coming back to post #89, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer.

Ultrasound: thickness of subcutaneous fat at specific sites. Less standardised than DXA and operator-dependent. Useful as a supplementary measure but not as a primary method.

1 like in reply to #20 23mo
RG
r.girardTL2 Moderator23 Aug 2024#92

Bioelectric impedance analysis: less precise than DXA and strongly affected by hydration state. Not reliable for detecting month-to-month changes. Useful for trend over years if done consistently.

0 likes 23mo
ZI
z.iyerTL224 Aug 2024#93
MS
m.stephanopoulosTL3Regular24 Aug 2024#94
batchlog, post #51: Lean mass loss during rapid weight reduction: depends on protein intake, resistance training volume, and total energy deficit. Adequate protein and maintaining training intensity both help preserve lean mass. Go to post

post #93 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

Maintenance phase: tracking body composition during maintenance (weight stable) is different from tracking during active loss. Changes are smaller and precision becomes more important.

11 likes in reply to #51 23mo
AA
a.adebayoTL2 Moderator24 Aug 2024 · edited#95
mi.amankwah, post #11: Having read the exchange above, I think I was wrong earlier in this topic and I want to say so plainly rather than quietly editing. The correction was fair and I had been repeating something I had not checked carefully enough. Go to post

I read post #93 twice before replying, because I had assumed the opposite.

Resting metabolic rate: body composition affects metabolic rate. As fat mass decreases and lean mass is maintained, metabolic rate is usually maintained better than with simple weight loss alone.

0 likes in reply to #11 23mo
BF
b.fonsecaTL2 Moderator25 Aug 2024#96

This follows post #93 rather than contradicting it.

Thank you for the correction. I have edited my earlier post with a note rather than silently, so the thread still makes sense to read. The error was mine and it was the kind that comes from remembering a figure instead of looking it up.

0 likes 23mo
DT
d.tammTL2 Moderator25 Aug 2024#97

Comparison to published data: the trials reported mean fat and lean mass changes. Individual results vary around that mean. Being above or below average is not a sign of something wrong.

17 likes 23mo
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a.zamoraTL2 Moderator25 Aug 2024#98

Changes during titration: measuring body composition during active titration is less useful than measuring after dose is stable. Titration causes fluid shifts that confound body composition.

7 likes 23mo
RA
r.aldana_pharmdTL4Pharmacist26 Aug 2024#99
Tavares, post #1: Posting this under the heading it deserves: Circumference measurements as a poor man's composition estimate Everything below is what sits behind that. Longitudinal report with the method stated, because a number without a method is not a measurement. Same scale, same time of day, same conditions, 46 weeks. I have also recorded protein… Go to post

Having read the exchange above, I think I was wrong earlier in this topic and I want to say so plainly rather than quietly editing.

The correction was fair and I had been repeating something I had not checked carefully enough.

0 likes in reply to #1 23mo
EV
e.vargaTL2 Moderator26 Aug 2024#100
j.silva, post #78: Thank you for the correction. I have edited my earlier post with a note rather than silently, so the thread still makes sense to read. The error was mine and it was the kind that comes from remembering a figure instead of looking it up. Go to post

Picking up post #97: that is the part I would want checked first.

Precision versus accuracy: the precision you need depends on what question you are answering. "Am I losing fat?" requires less precision than "Is my lean mass preservation within the expected range?"

25 likes in reply to #78 23mo
EC
excursion_checkTL3Regular26 Aug 2024 · edited#101
r.nakamura, post #49: Bioelectric impedance analysis: less precise than DXA and strongly affected by hydration state. Not reliable for detecting month-to-month changes. Useful for trend over years if done consistently. Go to post

Ultrasound: thickness of subcutaneous fat at specific sites. Less standardised than DXA and operator-dependent. Useful as a supplementary measure but not as a primary method.

0 likes in reply to #49 23mo
SV
s.vanheckeTL2 Moderator27 Aug 2024#102

post #101 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

Bioelectric impedance analysis: less precise than DXA and strongly affected by hydration state. Not reliable for detecting month-to-month changes. Useful for trend over years if done consistently.

22 likes 23mo
BM
buffer_marginTL3Regular27 Aug 2024#103

Two things before anyone answers the substance.

First, the context in the first post is clear and specific. Second, the question is framed so that an answer can actually address it. Both are the norm here and both matter more than they sound.

10 likes 23mo
AH
a.hartmannTL2 Moderator28 Aug 2024#104

Visceral fat: DXA does not distinguish visceral (organ-associated) fat from subcutaneous fat. That distinction might matter but requires different imaging to measure.

3 likes 23mo
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PSkarbekTL3Regular28 Aug 2024#105
h.mensah, post #40: post #39 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different. Changes during titration: measuring body composition during active titration is less useful than measuring after dose is stable. Titration causes fluid shifts that confound body composition. Go to post

Worth separating two things that post #101 runs together.

Resting metabolic rate: body composition affects metabolic rate. As fat mass decreases and lean mass is maintained, metabolic rate is usually maintained better than with simple weight loss alone.

31 likes in reply to #40 23mo
KH
k.haddadTL2 Moderator28 Aug 2024#106
a.cardoso, post #17: Resting metabolic rate: body composition affects metabolic rate. As fat mass decreases and lean mass is maintained, metabolic rate is usually maintained better than with simple weight loss alone. Go to post

post #105 is right about the mechanism and I think understates the practical bit.

Comparison to published data: the trials reported mean fat and lean mass changes. Individual results vary around that mean. Being above or below average is not a sign of something wrong.

16 likes in reply to #17 23mo
VK
v.krastevTL2 Moderator29 Aug 2024#107

Maintenance phase: tracking body composition during maintenance (weight stable) is different from tracking during active loss. Changes are smaller and precision becomes more important.

6 likes 23mo
AS
a.silvaTL2 Moderator29 Aug 2024#108

I disagree with the reply above, and I think the disagreement is substantive rather than terminological.

The distinction being drawn does not survive when you look at the published data for this specific question. I would be glad to be shown wrong on this, because the version I am arguing against is more convenient.

1 like 23mo
NP
n.petrovTL2 Moderator29 Aug 2024#109

On post #105 — agreed on the reasoning, with one qualification.

Practical note that does not fit anywhere else. Whatever you conclude from this topic, write down what you did and when. The single most useful thing in your own records is not any individual result; it is that they are dated and consecutive.

23 likes 23mo
MA
m.achebeTL2 Moderator30 Aug 2024 · edited#110
r.jhannsdttir, post #6: Maintenance phase: tracking body composition during maintenance (weight stable) is different from tracking during active loss. Changes are smaller and precision becomes more important. Go to post

DXA (dual-energy X-ray absorptiometry): the standard for body composition in research. Precision is roughly ±1 kg for lean mass. Two scans six months apart on the same machine with the same technician give you useful information. Two scans six weeks apart on different machines tell you about the machines.

11 likes in reply to #6 23mo
GP
g.pemberton_ukTL3Regional · UK30 Aug 2024#111

Lean mass loss during rapid weight reduction: depends on protein intake, resistance training volume, and total energy deficit. Adequate protein and maintaining training intensity both help preserve lean mass.

0 likes 23mo
AV
ai.vukovicTL2 Moderator30 Aug 2024#112

Ultrasound: thickness of subcutaneous fat at specific sites. Less standardised than DXA and operator-dependent. Useful as a supplementary measure but not as a primary method.

3 likes 23mo
DT
dexa_twice_yearlyTL3Regular31 Aug 2024#113

post #112 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

For anyone arriving from a search: the marked solution above is the direct answer, and the replies underneath it add the caveats that make it safe to use.

11 likes 23mo
Moved from Progress reports by bench_notes. Category placement is not obvious from outside and getting it wrong is expected. This topic will get better answers here. The move is recorded in the public log citing R7.

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